Soon after this trip, I received a letter from momster. My reaction to seeing the envelope in the mailbox was very different from any reaction I have ever had – I was not bothered by it at all. I remembered my positive experience in reading the last letter and thought that I don’t need anyone else to screen it for me this time. I must be healing enough that momster no longer has the power to trigger me. It’s OK that she wrote me. I’ll just read it.
This letter was again very different from prior letters, and I felt so peaceful reading it. I noted where she referred to herself as an elderly woman who needs to keep her mind active. I thought that if she was smart enough and a manipulative person, that comment would have been the perfect thing to say because I saw that she is no longer a threat. I could see her as this safe, old woman who could no longer hurt me. She is no longer a threat. I don’t need to stay away from her.
I wasn’t even bothered by her asking me for my email address so we could stay in touch through email. I thought, “I could do that,” and wanted to email her immediately as well as write her back. However, I did not. I thought that this was such a 180 in my reaction to momster – there is no rush in taking action. Let me sit on it. If I still want to send her my email address or a letter, I can do it in a week or two. She has waited over nine years for a reconciliation. I don’t have to do it today.
I don’t have the dates written down, but the timing is consistent with when the insomnia started. Out of seemingly nowhere, I could not fall asleep. I would awaken in the middle of the night with my heart pounding, and I could not get back to sleep. I took various sleep aids that have always worked (at least some of the time) to no avail. I used my many tools for combatting insomnia, but nothing has worked. This has been a sleepless summer for me.
Another very important point – this letter was my secret. I felt very strongly that I wanted to reconnect with momster and did not want anyone else talking me out of it because they would not understand. So, I told NO ONE. I did not blog about it, and I did not tell my closest friends. I did not mention the letter to ANYONE until I told a friend while we were across the country, and it was a “by the way” light mention along with me believing my different reaction was a sign of healing. I was in tears when I got back to my hometown. I thought it was for a different reason. Now I wonder if it was because I “told” about the letter.
More next week…
Photo credit: Hekatekris
Blooming Lotus 
I like everything in its own sweet time … your clock, your rules.
Our best,
Anns
(((((Faith)))))
There is so much meaning, and so much I’m learning, in what you’re writing now. Thank you for putting your personal struggles online for the rest of us to benefit from. Such amazing courage you have.
It’s sooo troubling that your momster’s letters took you to a place where you (consiously) felt peaceful and welcoming of her communication, and were willing to consider getting in touch with her through e-mail. Thank GOD(!!!) for your body’s reaction letting you know something was very wrong.
Puts me in mind of something Michael had told me a few months ago about my nightmares with wild animals (which were violent and gruesome); he said that he views the animals not as threats, but as guides (he used a better term, which I can’t remember offhand – totem’s perhaps?). He suggested I could view mine similarly, as guides to the information my body was trying to tell me and needed me to know. That has made such a difference for me, understanding that those bad reactions aren’t trying to punish me, they’re trying to warn and protect me. That perspective has helped me immensely.
(Note: I apologize in advance for all the questions below. Not really meant to pester you – I’m just trying to understand, and putting them out there in case you feel up to responding.)
Viewed in that light, it sounds like your insomnia and tears were, perhaps, your body’s version of that? Given what you’re dealing with, your body appears to be very wise. Reading about your reaction makes me start to feel grateful for my own, which is quite a turn-around (Grateful for your nightmares? Are you crazy!?!?!).
But at the time, did you have any awareness at all that your insomnia, etc… might have been related to the letters? And were you at all aware of the strangeness (and danger) of keeping all of it a secret?
In an effort to try to understand programming (from your previous post), I did a bit of research about post-hypnotic suggestion – which was the only thing I could find that sounded similar. Not sure how much that applies here – would love to get feedback on what RA survivors think. What I read was that people can be made to do all kinds of strange and bizarre things through post-hypnotic suggestion (e.g. bark like a dog upon hearing a certain word), but most often the professionals state that you can’t be prompted to do something you wouldn’t do normally (as in you wouldn’t do something that contravenes your own moral code). But then I had a flash of insight; most public ‘truths’ are written for and about those who grew up in ‘good-enough’ homes, not for those who’ve grown up or lived in violent &/or severely coercive environments. So I started to doubt the truth of that “truth” for RA or EA survivors. The whole point of severe abuse (one of them) is to force victims to do what they wouldn’t normally. Once that hurdle has been crossed (for the abusers, I mean) that victims have learned it’s safer not to fight and to just comply/submit, it doesn’t take a big leap to imagine that they could then implant suggestions for victims to do things that are against their own interests.
Do you have any feeling what the calmness was about? Was it truly a feeling of being ‘peaceful’ or were you consciously aware that there must be more to it? Does dissociation enter into it at all, or was it something entirely different?
Thank you Faith, for putting this out there for us to learn from.
“the professionals state that you can’t be prompted to do something you wouldn’t do normally (as in you wouldn’t do something that contravenes your own moral code”
You are correct in that is what professionals think. Give me three days of controlling them and they will changer their mind. Thing is I get to pick the three days and they never know it is coming. That is the first step. I know that sounds harsh. Reality is like that.
Hypnotic suggestions are not effective or it would work with quitting smoking which it does not every athlete would have it done.
That being said with out trauma you can get a person to seemingly do something that is against there moral code. The way this is done is with trust. It is more of Dr. Cameron of MJULTRA work. He showed that he could hypnotize a person and have them throw acid is someones face. What he did through trust was have them think it was not acid. He never had anyone throw acid in anyone face on camera or that is public knowledge He switched the acid with water after the person had smelled the acid.
Much of MKULTA programming was done with a gun with blanks over and over and over. Then real bullets are used. That is what is expected in Bobby Kennedy’s death and is in court right now.
The programming is often done with death as a possibility. It is so important to know that the person is in a physical state that few people ever experience. To be blunt I am not impressed with what Navy Seals go through.
There is also the thing about choice. Pushing your body to extremes is not the same as having your body pushed to extremes.
I actually experienced my brain shutting down and then coming back doing the work of therapy. I can tell when it is starting to happen and when it comes back. I have no idea how numbers work they make no sense is part of it. One thing I never lose is the homing instinct. I know what direction I live in. As a multiple that is not always the same place.
Some times I can not speak. That part of my brain is not working. It is not fear. It is just not there. Actually if there was danger then I could speak.
——————
So much of this is about the body being different and not deficient. The current model of who the body and brain works is based on what is average and what is not average is something wrong and how do we correct it. I think we are more different on the inside than the outside.
Not processing trauma and trying to keep if from coming in the consciousnesses makes people sick. I think this is from the reptilian brains/hippo campus. It mirrors so close hypothermia after then initial being cold. If you are on top of it and it is minor it hypothermia lasts for a week.
A body and brain doing processing trauma is different than a PTSD body and way different than a normal body. And all PTSD bodies and bodies processing are different and they do not stay the same through out the healing.
Even the simple things are not known. It takes lots and lots of calories to process trauma. It is so easy to get dehydrated. Things is while processing my body does not take on water if I am deep into expressive therapy.
I wasted a lot of time trying to find my center and it was outside my body. Not going to figure that out by research.
Hi, Michael.
I wrote my response before reading yours.
Re: “You are correct in that is what professionals think. Give me three days of controlling them and they will changer their mind. Thing is I get to pick the three days and they never know it is coming. That is the first step. I know that sounds harsh. Reality is like that.”
I respect your opinion and concede that you (sadly) know more about this topic than I do. If you say this is possible, I believe you. This is not part of the trail where we need to “get loud” with each other. LOL
“The programming is often done with death as a possibility. It is so important to know that the person is in a physical state that few people ever experience. To be blunt I am not impressed with what Navy Seals go through.”
Damn. That really does put it in perspective. I am in awe that you came out of your childhood experiences as the kind and compassionate person you are.
I have processed enough of the trauma triggered by this letter to know it ties into saving my younger sister’s life. I don’t have specific details and am not sure I need them to heal it since I have processed similar trauma before. I will talk with my therapist about this when I see him.
~ Faith
“I am in awe that you came out of your childhood experiences as the kind and compassionate person you are.”
It is pretty simple. It is the result of compassion shown to me. I do not know what became the children that experienced trauma worse than I. Nor do I know what trauma the abusers experienced. I can only know what I can know about me.
I do not value having or feeling compassion for others. That is pretty easy. It is taking care of me so I can show compassion that is hard.
I have a minor example. I picking up the trash at a pubic beach. People often thank me. I tell them I have another bag if they want to help. They do not. They just want to feel like they did something by thanking me. I don’t need that or want that as I am not picking up the trash for them. I just like the beach better if the trash is picked up.
Michael,
Thank you for all your inputs on programming – that’s so helpful, and appreciated.
“Give me three days of controlling them and they will changer their mind. Thing is I get to pick the three days and they never know it is coming. That is the first step. I know that sounds harsh. Reality is like that.”
I’ve been struggling with a version of the concept you used above. There was an incident I won’t go into here where a discussion with someone made me realize that – if I tried – I could know what my mother would be thinking in a particular situation. It’s the kind of knowledge I almost wish I didn’t realize I could have. I pretty much try to stay away from it – even just pulling the curtain back and taking the tiniest glimpse into her way of thinking makes me feel ill. But I’ve slowly come to the realization that not understanding it – especially by the professionals who should know better – is exactly what allows evil people to operate so freely in society. And I FOR SURE know that my mother just sits back and laughs and laughs at all those stupid people who don’t get it. I know that I need to be able to ‘go there’ without losing my humanity, but it almost feels like the human equivalent of touching kryptonite.
But these days my anger at the hypocrisy and arrogance (and sheer inhumanity and indifference) of many in the helping professions to most victims of severe child abuse (most victims, period, actually) makes me realize that it might just take “going there” to form the arguments that prove it. But “going there” is a dangerous proposition, and perhaps a zero-sum game?
So any words of advice re: how someone can go “there” and know “that”, and come back out again with the information you need, and still retain your humanity and sanity? I would imagine it’s not an easy thing to do.
Oh, and thank you for: “There is also the thing about choice. Pushing your body to extremes is not the same as having your body pushed to extremes.”
Birdfeeder,
“And I FOR SURE know that my mother just sits back and laughs and laughs at all those stupid people who don’t get it.”
That is true for sure. Both that they laugh and most people are stupid and do not get it. Actually it is not that they are stupid it just suits their needs. I do believe the stupid people deep down know. Judging by there anger when I point out their delusions. I only do so when in a bad mood. It does not change anything. I do think the internet is helping. It is still shielded. The other day I read that a sex ring was being dismantled and there were photos of infants apparently dead. Did not warrant the attention badminton players throwing a game or that Obama played golf.
Sandusky is in jail right now figuring somehow he will get away with it still.
As far as advice I can tell you I do not know of an easy way. I find it all worth it although it was years where I often questioned if it was. I do not feel that the half way measures of just knowing what happened is worth it is as people seem to still have PTSD.
It is really about discovery and finding a way to what has not been done before. What is known about trauma is mostly about what I call trauma lite. Then what is known about trauma lite is applied to other traumas. When I write trauma lite I mean the trauma that is part of the normal human experience and does not effect the reptilian brains.
There is much knowledge that I have I wish I did not have. Like colleges are a great place for people who want to abuse as are all schools. I seem to see more quickly to the real cause. I was curious about what in the world the boy scouts were doing with the not accepting openly gay people. Is there anymore group more “:gay” that the boy scouts? Well now I know. The Mormon church funds 37% and the Catholic Church and the Southern Baptists have a large share of ownership. There is you answer and why it was a secret meeting when the decisions was made and no one wants them to know who was at the meeting as they are ashamed. There might be in the future some rubbish about how they were protecting the Boy Scouts and made the hard decision for the good of the scouts. Well that is nice, now tell me how much you made working for this non-profit that you were protecting.
For a while it really came down to I had to risk tearing up by body to try and process or let if be torn up by not. It is not a safe thing to process horror. I have over time come to trust that I will not lose my sanity or humanity. That is why it is a problem.
Somewhere you wrote the false belief that you had to protect your sister was given as an explanation. It is not the child is fooled is it therapist do not face what really happens to children. It is to much for them.
Yes the cults do fake deaths. It is a cover for the ones they really kill and to find out who will join them. I can not imagine how hard it is for a therapist who deals with extreme trauma to know that when someone describes a fake death it means they may have been experienced real deaths. That the small animals and pets killed may mean the person will have to do harder work later. I rag on therapist a lot. I respect the few that understand they do not understand and still are able to be there with out trying to explain or understand. A very select few.
I tried to save many many people that were being abused. I failed with many they are dead. I am so very glad I tried and so very sorry I failed. Some therapist think knowing there is survivors guilt somehow means it goes away. They nod and identify it. “Problem solved.”
I do want to note that writing here I am sure I come off as negative and my life is misery. It is hard and I do suffer. I do have quite a bit of fun.
Hi, birdfeeder.
“But at the time, did you have any awareness at all that your insomnia, etc… might have been related to the letters? And were you at all aware of the strangeness (and danger) of keeping all of it a secret?”
No, I had no idea why I was suddenly unable to sleep. The letters never even crossed my mind! And, no, I felt quite peaceful about keeping my thoughts about momster a secret. Scary, huh?
I think you and Michael are onto something — that despite one part of myself feeling drawn to contact, my body was SCREAMING at me that something was very, very wrong. I am going to make a better effort to listen to my body, which is new to me. I did it yesterday as my friend talked me through what was in the letter (that blog entry will publish on 8/14). Rather than react, I paid attention to my body’s signals and felt the reflux again when she broached the topic that was clearly the most triggering part for me.
I actually agree with the hypnotherapist that we can only be “programmed” to act in accordance with our values. Believe it or not, my “desire” to reconnect with momster was in accordance with my value of keeping my little sister safe. The “peace” was in believing that making contact and keeping quiet would save her life (which was the lie I was told as a girl). So, I was at war with myself — Sacrificing myself to save my sister is true to who I am, and protecting myself from momster is also true to who I am. Both sides battled it out, but (thankfully) the larger part of myself, which values self-preservation and knows that the threat against my sister has no teeth, won the war.
~ Faith
Hi Faith,
That IS very scary, but also a very strong lesson for all of us. Thank you so much for sharing it.
Reminds me of something I read about con artists – they almost always sound like they’re speaking logic and appealing to you on a logical level, but what they are universally doing is playing your emotions; it’s only on the emotional level that our senses get hi-jacked specifically to interrupt our ability to think things through logically and see the truth of the situation.
I’m still not able to listen to my body, but since learning to listen to my nightmares they have completely changed: I still get graphically violent images at times, but they no longer terrify and completely paralyze me. They still do put me into hypervigilant mode, because I know they’re there to warn me about some kind of danger. I recently had a disturbing nightmare about someone I had mistakenly thought was innocuous, but hurting and in need of friendship (it wasn’t the actual person in my dream, but my husband easily put together who the dream was about). Shortly afterward that person proved to be not who I had thought they were, and – seemingly out of nowhere -became very threatening, alluding to violence and more. “I” hadn’t picked up on that, but my body certainly had. I still find I get overwhelmed trying to listen to my body (I think it’s been screaming at me for years, which is probably why I’ve been ill for so long), but I think I may try to spend small measured amounts of time trying to listen to it.
It’s the info about your sister – specifically about how you were programmed to do things against your own self-interest via the false belief that you were putting yourself in harm’s way to protect her – that resonates for me. Just this week I was telling my therapist about a ‘flashback’ (not really a flashback, but I have no other description for it) I had when my husband and I were first dating. Coming home one night there was a car parked across from the entrance to my apt – in front of my parking garage. I could see the driver’s face from the streetlight; she looked exactly like my mother/monster – a nasty sour expression and evil hateful eyes. I immediately went into that “shocky” place where time slows down and your thinking goes haywire sorting through the millions of possibilities. My then-boyfriend knew very little about my history, so there was no way in that timeframe to let him know what was going on. What I ended up doing was crossing the street, but putting myself between him and that car and walking with my arms out wide, so that if she tried to run us down it would take me out first and I could push him out of the way if I had to. Afterwards I sat in the corner of my bedroom and didn’t come out the whole weekend. God knows why my then-boyfirnd didn’t leave me right then and there…
My therapist thought it was odd that my reaction was to protect him: “You know you’d be the one she was going run over, don’t you?” It drove home the realization that I’d spent my whole childhood putting myself in harms way under the mistaken assumption that I was protecting my brothers by doing that, and I was just repeating this old behaviour. One of my biggest feelings of betrayal is finally seeing/realizing that they would never do the same for me, and in fact have lined up with my mother this whole time. I have ZERO idea how or why I started to believe this (that ‘volunteering’ for the abuse was saving my brothers); not that it isn’t something she wouldn’t do in a heartbeat, just that it isn’t her style.
What’s scary is realizing that, even now, that is my default behaviour: to put myself in the way of serious life-threatening harm to protect others – pretty much any others. What’s even scarier is starting to realize that I’m not even sure I know what the right steps are to take to protect myself.
Sorry to ramble on so long here, Faith. You’ve given me a lot to think about.
Hey Birdfeeder,
First good Effort!
The idea of protecting someone else is fundamental to my being. I seriously am fearless if there is someone else to protect. At the time the danger is going on I am as calm as calm can be. My heart rate actually goes down. Time does slow down and for me my whole brain works differently. If I could stay in that state I could be a professional athlete. And then there is the after. I never connected the after until a lot of memory work was done. My brain was not capable.
I no longer have nightmares. I differentiated between night terrors and nightmares. A night terror is where I am kinda back in time. After those it was like I had run 20 miles I was so tired. I expect I will have nightmares in the future. I now can just get up and walk around and go back to sleep.
I do not interpret dreams. I just let dreams be dreams. I do have other states that are not dreams and they are about actual events. I do notice things. If I see ice or water in a dream I know there is memory work that is going to happen.
Now my protecting someone else is not at all what I would call programming. First it is the reptilian brains way to protect those in the group at times. It is really about how I protected I. It is not the I dissociated and did not experience the trauma.
I will give an example. I was raped while in boy scouts in a gym. I was then playing basket ball in the same gym and walking home at night. Some of the same scouts cornered me on the way home from basketball and beat me up. I had quit scouts the year before and this was the next year. I never had an issue one on one with anyone that was not armed. I had separated the scouts that raped me and got it so I was alone with them. They ran as all cowards do.
So I want to play basketball and have to figure out a way to avoid this group of scouts who knew when I would be walking home from basketball. How did it was walk thought the woods at night. I experienced it as having someone beside me that I needed to protect. There were two of us walking through the wood as part of me was outside my body. I had to walk by a place in the woods I had been raped and past a place where I had killed a boy by shooting him in the head while under the control of someone either from the cult or part of the MKULTRA program. It just came back to me there was also a full moon.
Just figured out what the MKULTRA program wanted was a person like no other. On who was fearless and they did not belong to a group. Trust me marines. nave seals, police ect are well cowards outside the group and live in fear. First reaction if a cop is to call for back up.
I am guessing here. When you saw the person that looked like you mother you reptilian brain sensed danger and it was there from some source. I would never say that you over reacted ect. I bet there was danger there somewhere. It was not programming it was more a better sense of danger than most people have. I am really guessing here.
Most people do not understand the difference between danger and scary and have no real way to evaluate. Being a fireman is not dangerous and less so now they do not fall off the back of trucks It is scary. Some therapist drove me nuts with the perceived danger thing. Being almost drowned is dangerous.
Often rather than programming or even conditioned it might be better to think in terms of growing up in an environment were it was best for my body to … In a way the concept of programming keeps it on a upper brain level and that is not where the problem is or where it can be processed and put in the past. One of the reasons to stay away from the programming is it is not effective where as the developing in a dangerous environment is. Again post hypnotic suggestions have proven to not be effective.
Just wanted to write a little bit about how what is often called programming works.
At one level I have programmed my cat to not bother me about eating if it is not yet 6:00 I point to the clock and he knows to be quiet. I am guessing he does not know how to tell time. Smile.
What most people call programming is really association.
With trauma the association is stored differently. It is not dissociated. It is stored just where trauma should be stored. It is not anything that any one does or causes it is how the brain works. There is no choice involved.
How things are associated other than trauma is determined by the source of information. If you write scientists predicts. It carries weight with some people as they associate it with an imaginary “scientist”. I is one so I can say that. Certified as both a wetland and soil’s scientist. Trust me we don’t know much except about dirt yet people will buy that we do about all sorts of things.
So back to programming. If I write “every time you see ….. today think about ….. Often you will think about that no matter how hard you try not to.
If I write “every time you see …. wonder what color Michael’s car is. It is totally different. First those of you that have an imaginary Michael will be effected differently than those who are not familiar with my comments here as I used my name. I picked a color on purpose as it is a strong association.
I am jumping ahead in development to when a child’s association is at the point where they do not see in black and white, images are reversed, smell is less important etc. Those associations are very very strong even in a adult.
I am skipping now to how which craft cults over centuries developed their programming with the moon when everyone else went to the sun calender.
First it was power to be able to know what the moon was going to do. It was always there everyday. It was common. Everyone knew what the moon was. They saw it each night if the clouds were not out and because it is white and has different shapes the association is very strong. We take counting for granted. Humans did not always know how to count. Being able to count meant you could predict what shape the moon was going to be. Close enough so the minor differences of the 29 day cycle did not matter. The range is 29,3 and 29,8. Add being able to tell when the moon is going to eclipse and you are now not just a God but and important God.
So you start messing with the child’s brain about the moon. Just say a few things make it a big deal and a big mystery. Then make some nice promises ect. Now the abuser is all excited about what is going to happen on this full moon thing and the child picks up on that. An association is established and the child may not even know what the word moon means.
Then a horror happens at a place. Place is a very strong association for the reptilian brain. Most important to avoid danger. The full moon is going on at the time this horror takes place. Framed by a tree or a mountain as this give a shape/spacial association.
After the horror the child can be made to have any associations the abuser wants. They can say draw a circle in the air and the child will know to make an association, Any word even one that is non-related can be associated. Holding of three fingers can be part of the association. Thing is the reptilian brains are confused and that is what messes up the association.
These associations can be built on with anything and it causes confusion. The confusion is the abusers tool.
Then the child starts to make their own associations. Might be a fun time during a full moon like sliding or something. The association does not work the same as if the reptilian brains were not confused.
The reptilian brains see and think in shapes. colors,places, smells ect. It does not use words nor is it changed with them.
There are no more murders, crimes, births or admittance to hospitals. It is a myth easily dispelled yet it persists. Reptilian brain wins. I do believe that the full moon does have an effect. I know better that to believe the myth. Why it as an effect I nor any one else knows.
Any word can be used to create an association. It seems like a code and seems universal it might not be. The a few I remember are exercising, getting a lollipop, going camping, going on an adventure. going to school etc.
The word or anything else will cause an association. The strength of the association depends on many things. Who says it. Is is verbal or is it an image. Is it out of place say a Halloween costume in the summer. Is it close yet not really there like say a robe in a play.
Even within the context of the person it is never the same. There are to may variable. One might be tired so the association is strong or they might be to tied to make the association. It just goes on and on with the variables.
_____________
While I am at it I will go over place In ancient times it was a holy place where the horror happened. Often made holy by those that understood fire. Cults now use many places. I am only familiar with rural ones. They want a place were no one will happen upon them. Sometimes it is in the middle of a wetland and only one way in. It is often not associated with anyone in the group. Some I know of are fair grounds. No one is there when there is not fair and they are usually flat so it can be watched. Dead end roads that can be guarded are used. There is an escape plan which leaves the victim there to answer questions which they can not as everyone was in hoods and they were blindfolded. The child could never come up with a story that would be believed. Summer camps when school is open are used. Warehouses are used and the lock is the same type with a different key. In my case a house was once used that was in an estate with no beneficiaries. So the judge or lawyer used the house. Cabins that no cult member owns are use. Any public place can be used as no one owns it.
One thing that is hard for the reptilian brains is when they are in a place where they have been and it was not a horror. Even harder when it is in a different season. The reptilian brains think in temperature and amount of light. So say they are at a fairgrounds in the winter the smells etc to not make any sense.
My car is black.
Michael.
Thank you so much for this. I express how validating it is.
I have always been sensitive to the full moon. I try to track in on the calendar, but I will sometimes forget. I’ll have insomnia and a bad headache but not know way. The next day, I’ll look at the calendar and see there is a full moon. (I am most sensitive the night before, not the day of.)
What you wrote is consistent with my memories of the place.
Thank you for this.
~ Faith
The images you pick scream what happened, Not what you write.
Hi, Michael.
Interesting. I struggle with what image to use and am grateful to hekatekris for offering to let me use her photos because she is so talented and they are so powerful. I just feel drawn to some but don’t know why. Not everyone has the talent you do to read the story through the photos (at least I don’t)!
I have an idea what you mean, though. I am very intuitive when it comes to understanding people’s dreams — not in all case, of course, because some dream symbols are specific to individuals. The better I know someone, the better able I seem to be to “read” their dreams.
This ability has put me in an awkward position more than once. Sometimes the truth in the dream is glaringly obvious to me and the dreamer doesn’t see it, and I don’t know if it is my place to enlighten him or her. Other times, I cringe when someone shares a dream publicly because I “get it” and feel like he or she just inadvertently shared a page of a diary publicly.
I wonder if you are sometimes in that position with me — if you can tell something about my own struggle that I cannot see yet through interpreting the image choice??
~ Faith
More on programming.
Ultimately unless you are under control financially or physically it is now your programming. Simple to the point of not being much help. It is the reality.
Some would see it as the issue is what is going on in the unconscious. The unconscious being a term that is used to describe that which we know little about.
Until proven other wise the only way to successfully have the “programming” no longer have an effect is through expression, new experiences and staying as non-present as safely as possible. if you make it totally safe you will fail. I do not know if transference is necessary to have programming have no effect or it just makes it a lot easier. Still not easy.
You can reprogram say being programmed to believe you are not unique and all trauma has the same effect and the only option you have is to cope is one way to go. You can create subsets of extreme trauma, trauma by a caregiver, trauma by a group etc. Or the reprogramming that you dissociate due as a way to protect which comes from the mid 1800’s is another option. You can have a therapist become the new programmer.
Until proven other wise the real control is done through the reptilian brains. Having the reptilian brains forced to go against what they know to be wrong and would not do if they had a choice.
The concept of in the persons best interest I think is valid. It is impossible for anyone who had not had horrible horrible choices to understand what can be made to be in your best interest.
I am warming up to the idea of a camp to teach therapists about trauma. Thing is once they learn they will need years of therapy. It would have to be pretty light as an adult body could not survive.
Michael – I think it is very necessary to have some sort of “camp to teach therapists about trauma.” But the more I learn, the more it seems that the “therapists” will probably need to come from the ranks of those who have experienced trauma themselves. And also from those who have inflicted trauma on others, but have genuinely changed their ways.
: ) Truth Seeker.
I would not even consider someone as being competent to work with me had they not gone through psychotherapy and expressive therapy. Qualified yes, competent no.
I am not sure about the requirement of having experienced trauma. I know that it is not necessary to have experienced similar trauma as my therapist is helpful
and she certainly did not experience similar trauma.
I know that having experienced trauma and wanting to help as a substitute for doing the intensive work of therapy would be a mess for both involved and often that is the case. Spare me from those who learned how to heal and have yet to discover how to heal and think they have. Spare me from those who do not understand the do not understand.
A camp to teach therapist would be wrong. I was writing to make a point. It would harm not only the therapists but those that ran the camp.
I know of a bright person who for $3,000 agreed to be kept awake for 72 hours. She has never recovered. I would do it and they would learn nothing. I would just go very close to a coma and then take a week to recover. Actually I would not. There are easier ways to may $ 3,000
Maybe not a military-style camp. Perhaps a group of people who know exactly what deep trauma entails, getting together to tell qualified therapists the truth about trauma? (As opposed to a single person not being listened to by a group of therapists – that is, an association of therapists who all feel that they are bound together in their beliefs. That can be hard to break through) Perhaps having some sort of associated group of trauma survivors would carry some weight in getting the knowledge out to the people who can use it to help heal others, with sensitivity and understanding?
It like so much else is a preaching to the choir thing. Those that can get it will. About the only thing is to make it easier for them and therefore quicker. The coping crowd would have to admit they hurt many people with there arrogance and that is not likely to happen.
Reasonable to assume most therapists have the opportunity to understand they were not taught what they need to know.
I wanted to write on bonding. Not the mythical concept,
Much of control is about bonding. Lets pick how you get young men to kill for you. It is called basic training. First take everything away, then control everything, push them physically then do some fake killing. Sing some songs give some nice looking uniforms. Send them back home and have everyone oh an ah over them. The bond is established in only 10 weeks. Simple. Note: Make sure the men are younger than 21 as by 21 the human brain will see through it.
Another myth is the there is something wrong with the person who bonds with an abuser. In the case of basic training it is OK as it is accepted. Note: If you do see combat and it adversely effects you perhaps as there was preexisting trauma see you homeless on the streets.
There is nothing wrong with the person who bonds with the abuser. Some therapists see people who are still controlled by the cults either financially or physically. I can not imagine trying to deal with that seeing a person an hour a week or ever three.
I used to run large crews of men in construction. Over 100. I would walk out of my trailer each morning and say. Its 7 o’clock gentlemen and walk back in. Once for fun I did not and when I did those 100 men were very frigidity and off the whole day. Those men did what I asked. I was 26 years old and weighted 150 libs. We had a bond. I will tell you a story. I was in a ditch talking to my some of my crew who were also my friends. One of then called me a A-hole just kidding around. There were three in the ditch. Catfish and Rainbow who were from a different crew that worked for me jumped into the ditch a distance of about 12 feet. Catfish turned to Rainbow and said “Which two do I get.” It is all about bonding.
A bond of someone smaller than you and you see yourself as taking care of them and they see you as taking care of them is a very very strong bond and easily manipulated.
Back to my teaching therapist about trauma in three days. All you have to do is tell them you will harm their children and they will do things that are not in their best interest just in case.
More on Programming.
This is complicated for me as I experienced programming by behavioral scientists in the MKULTRA program and that is different. Plus I have the cult programming from many cults. I also have the normal programming of say the school system which everyone has.
I do have a mom story. My biological mother who is not a physical or sexual abuser rather just sold her son to the MKULTRA program being told I would be a super being and she dissociates a lot although is not a multiple. She is a poly anna. I avoid my family as they are emotional abusive in that I am the scapegoat. That and they are dull and arrogant. Anyway I am going to supper at my mothers. She invited me to a ham supper she makes a good ham. Then I find out it is leftovers. Just a little sign I am not important. I put it off and told her to freeze it. I have a job in the same town and figured it would be a good time to get the supper out of the way. Well she asked my a series of questions about the pool I swim at. She knows I love the pool. Then she says she is thinking of joining. No way in the world is she ever going to swim there. She just wants to try and take the enjoyment away. She might even buy a membership to try and aggravate me. Some of my older friends came to my fathers funeral. Part of it is my family is not cool like I am. They kinda want to tag along sometimes. That I never minded. Then they want to put what ever I do down. My parents bought me an art class. I was stunned beyond belief. Then I figured out I was supposed to do a colored pencil drawing as payment.
It feels like my family has a 6th sense to know when I am doing well and they try to destroy. I do not know if they do. What I do know is it is a constant thing with them and it is not going to change. My power which I hate to use is I can destroy their fantasy and show them to be dysfunctional. The only reason I do not totally write them off is there are finical considerations. Pretty much I see spending the little time I do with them as a job.
So I could frame this all in terms of programming. In my case it is just dysfunction.
_________________
There is what is called twinning with is similar to having a cult birthday or a cult name. The twinning is done by having two children that switch names when with the cult. That would be your twin. In my case my twin was killed as part of my preparation for the MKULTRA program.
The ceremonies are seen by most and even those that study cults as an excuse to commit abuse of children. It is much more complicated than that as are the cults. There are marriage ceremonies that are only recognized by the cult. A young woman is passed around and assaulted by the group at 16 ect. They have there own courts etc.
It is somewhat like a union where the members fight between themselves yet see the outside world as inferior and to be used. It is in part financial. They sell property to each other, give jobs to each other loan money to each other.
To understand the culture of the cults it is important to understand it is centuries old and nothing is written down. Each person has a place in the cult just like any group. The sexual perversion and the love of torturing and killing people gets the attention it is just part of it. It is a way of life and has been for a long long time. There are many sects within the cult. There are enforcers kinda the cult police, there are the bankers, there are the ones who plan the ceremonies, there are the doctors etc. A programmer is really their idea of an educator and often are. They have their priests, priestess or what ever. It is all chaotic mostly due to no written financial records. If you took away the financial structure of the Catholic Church it would crumble. Much of the cult culture is from rejecting the church at the time when the church ruled. A kinda holding on to when it was about clans. The cult culture co-exists with what is seen as normal culture. Those in the cult often have the same “position” in society as they do in the cult. Much like the banker ends up being a trusty in a church.
I can see all this only as I have processed the trauma. I used to see them only as people who hurt me. My family was not in the cult so all my contact with the cults was about hurting me. You could look at the cults as growing from the necessity of culling the weak.
______________
One of the most powerful tools the cults have is shunning. The not being shunned instinct is very very strong. It means death in a clan or tribe. All fundamental religions use it. it could be called programming.
_____________
Another programming is age programming and is tied into jewel and metal programming. At each cult birthday there is something that happens. This is done with steps as in visualize read steps. it is kinda a regression before you have reached that age and starts with age 21 at least in the cult I had to deal with daily until I was 5. There are ages where it is decided if you are killed. If you make it to age 21 than it takes a lot to have you killed. Age three is pretty standard if it looks like you will have not value to the cult or will be seen as a burden.
_________________
Now what I am personally dong is dong all this writing to convince my self I am smart. It is part of my process. I have just started to process the death of a classmate. It is different as I knew him in my public school life. It is also different as I was there when his younger brother was killed and I felt responsible. The mother was in the cult and a good looking widow. Her sons were killed so she could hook up with another cult member who had money.
I was the scapegoat for the first murder. I suspect that I was for the second and may have had a part in the killing. The end is framed by the listening to the impossible dream team red sox. 1967. So you see all this writing on programming is a diversion in a way. No blame taken this is very very hard. He was my friend I think.
This all came about through three things. One is it is August when it looked like the Red Sox might just stop being bums, I had as best I could processed my friends brothers murder. The other is I am a new rested through much hard work. The other is expressive therapy. Some were out in therapy in a different way. We have a string that has some of the glass work we did special for it on the string. The string is the same length as the perimeter of our bed. We laid the string on the floor and had explained to out therapist that it was her office but she can not come in the string. Even if she does she will not be in the string. We had the stuffed dragon with us and the one that is blind talked about the dragon. He only sees in memory if he is out by himself we are blind. He crashed a car once as we had been to the dentist and the anesthesia caused him to be out. It was interesting. We ended up in a river and he called out what must be going on from the sounds. “That must be the guard rails breaking. We are gong down hill over rocks. We just splashed we must be in water. We are floating. We have stopped floating Then others of us came to from the cold water and walked up the banking to the road. It was pretty funny the ambulance attendant was all pissed off. He said my hear rate was slower than his and my blood pressure less and he had just dragged me out of the river. At the hospital I was given warm blankets. It was worth it just to have those warm blankets.
Anyway please stay away from the simplistic concept of boundaries. Part of my make sure I forget programming was a string on my finger. A piece of yard from a hand made toy I had that was destroyed in many many ways including fire. It was a rabbit. The glass I made is kinda like the jewel programming. The number of the pieces has to do with the age programming. The sounds the glass makes both the notes and the clicks has to do with the sound programming. The place it is in my therapists office has much significance. Expressive therapy is a little more complicated than the boundary concept.
On the upside I enjoyed the mars landing. Everyone knows where they were during the lunar landing. I do not. I only know it was somewhere no child should ever be. I am going to a site today. It is a car dealership who screwed me when I bought my first used car from a dealership. I told him I would get even. I have not seen the site. I strongly suspect he has many violations and requires many permits. Just business you understand. A good way for me to work out some hostility and turn a profit.
This is hard.
Michael,
Perhaps if your mother wanted a “super-being” for a son, then this may have affected your desire to “show that you’re smart?” Just a thought.
I strongly believe that Love is of far more value than Smartness. But having said that, Love is wise. (True Love, pure love).
Do you personally believe there is a “necessity to cull the weak?” Who judges what constitutes “weakness?”
Perhaps if your mother wanted a “super-being” for a son, then this may have affected your desire to “show that you’re smart?”
No as I wrote it is part of my process. Not unlike I talk myself into thinking I know how to play golf despite years of proving I do not. Smile.
“Just a thought. I strongly believe that Love is of far more value than Smartness. But having said that, Love is wise.
Again not picking on you just writing about how rhetoric works. You start with a belief and a thought. “Just a thought. I strongly believe that Love is of far more value than Smartness.” then you follow with a statement as fact that is totally unconnected. “Love is wise.” This is a cognitive disconnect. It is easily dismantled by revering and taking our the connection from belief and thought which does not exist. The statement “Love is wise therefore Love is of far more value than smartness.” makes no sense it is totally disconnected.
“I believe and think that love is wise and of far more value than smartness.” is a “genuine” statement.
Another way rhetoric works utilizing the phrase “That being said” is to preface it with falsehoods. An attorney’s favorite.
I use “That being said” often and in a totally different way. I use it when there is a a difference between how I think and how I act or as a connection between two different views.
“I believe and think that love is wise and of far more value than smartness.” is a “genuine” statement.
That’s what I’d like to say. : )
(And you are smart ! I never learned about ‘rhetoric’)
If you want to learn about it just Google fallacies. Be warned it makes things difficult as you see through a lot. I used to hope it would be required in a every discipline in college. They do require statistics in rigorous degrees and advanced non rigorous degrees. That did not seem to have any effect.
Learning about fallacies is like learning the Rubik cube. It is really hard to learn it is not hard to do.
Michael,
“There are marriage ceremonies that are only recognized by the cult. A young woman is passed around and assaulted by the group at 16 ect..”
Would this be considered a marriage ceremony? And would the girl then “know” she was married? And to whom? It sounds like what happened to me. I couldn’t understand why. And still do not understand why.
I am very sorry to hear about your friend. And have to admit I use the technique of intense studying/writing/thought to help me distract me from the trauma. As well as rest/sleep. Not a “normal” kind of sleep though.
My thoughts are with you – you’ve been through so much. And understand so much. Your description of cults/sects is very helpful to me. It sounds “religious” and explains why I couldn’t go near anything religious for many many years. Especially *organized groups* of ‘worshippers.’
When I finally did start attending meetings of Jehovah’s Witnesses, when PTSD kicked in really intensely, people’s faces looked like faces from the past, and I would think they quite possibly were people from the group of abusers from the past. People who’ve known them for years would cancel that out, and I would be left with this awful feeling inside, and have to keep looking over my shoulder in case someone was coming in the door.
They’ve been very patient with me I think. I’m most comfortable with the little old ladies! Lately I’ve been researching child abuse and found this information linked to “good policy” on Jehovah’s Witnesses’ website. Not many religions have this sort of policy in place. But even so, I can see how individual congregations could still go sour, if the wrong men get in and form a sub-group within the ranks, especially when they work their way into positions of authority, especially in the judicial committee.
(www.watchtower.org/e/19970101/article_01.htm The info on child molesters is at the end of the article)
It really seems to come down to each parent’s responsibility of guardianship for their own children, to keep them safe. And this is why it is *so* heartbreaking when a child’s own parent betrays them. I feel enormously sad that your mother profited from abandoning you to MKultra. You are worth more than money. More than all the money in the world. ((This applies to all of you here reading — you are all precious, priceless, and worth more than all the gold and silver in the whole wide world.))
Other than a general overview how things work in the cults has no value. It is not scripted and all cults are not the same. The marriage I was involved in was when I was 5 years old.
Ironically the term cult is new (1950’s) and was coined by someone studying the new religions that were springing up. Including the Jehovah Witnesses.
The Jehovah Witnesses use the same tactics as all religions they are more obvious as they do not have the length of time of acceptance. You have to love the Catholic Church’s marketing developed over the centuries. You need us when you are born, when your children are born and when you die. If not you will suffer consequences that we made up.
There is a cognitive disconnect in all Jehovah Witnesses that I spoken with a refusal to accept that what they state as fact is a lie. They do not seem to have an understanding of the difference between a belief and a fact. The belief of the group became a fact.
Jehovah witnesses are deluded in that the believe they are special because they are Jehovah witnesses. They use rhetoric as a tool and do not even seen to recognize it.
“Not many religions have this sort of policy in place.” This is propaganda. The Jehovah Witnesses Elders institutionalized child abuse by having a policy of only accepting the possibility of abuse if it is witnessed and making it wrong to report the abuse. They enforced this with shunning. A psychological type of torture that is devastating.
” You are worth more than money. More than all the money in the world. ((This applies to all of you here reading — you are all precious, priceless, and worth more than all the gold and silver in the whole wide world.”
That is your belief. It is not for you to decide. Your saying so does not make it a truth.
I am not angry or picking on you nor does it take much effort to see through the Jehovah Witnesses it is that way with all new religions. As they develop they adapt. When “anonymous” rewrote the bible in the 1950’s to create the new religion it was not even called a translation (no is it) they adapted and started calling it a translation. In the 70’s the Jehovah Witnesses lost a lot of as the world did not end. They gained a lot by giving it a date. The Jehovah Witnesses have rewritten history and state well we never really did predict the world was going to end. They have now adapted it to well we don’t know when it is going to end we just know it is.
Often when speaking to Jehovah Witnesses it seems they somehow feel they can tell me how it is.
Over all the way the Jehovah Witnesses work is they offer kindness in times of trouble and they threaten to take it away if you do not conform though shunning. It is different with those raised in a Jehovah Witness family as a child only in that they offer kindness within the family then use the threat of shunning.
I used to enjoy the argument. Now it is boring. It is the same argument with all religions.
***religious triggers***
I perceive the things you speak of about the religion. It is very frustrating to deal with. I am somewhat frightened of the thought of your being “married” in such a way at 5 years old, and feel sad inside, but in a strange way because of feeling powerless.
“…policy of only accepting the possibility of abuse if it is witnessed.”
I’ve experienced this in a much less serious incident, where it comes down to one person’s word against another. However, I notice that even police don’t do much if it’s one person’s word against another. And cases don’t reach court unless there is enough ‘evidence’ that they believe they’ll be able to convict.
Then, there are people I know who’ve believed their child, and taken the other parent to court about abuse, only to find the offender is let off, and the child called a liar in the courtroom. The adult offender comes up with a more convincing argument than the traumatized child.
I do not know how to solve this problem. I’ve been told that sometimes it is a matter of waiting for another victim to come forward and report a similar incident by the same offender before anything further can be done.
***triggering to Jehovah’s Witnesses in particular***
(This is a minor issue in relation to the deep traumas shared in this blog, but for me it has been a safe way of creating a frame of reference in my mind for more serious situations. It’s been triggering me for the past three years or so.)
At present I find it hard to go in to meetings at my congregation due to the situation where one of the elders took a year of pretending to apologize, etc, only to flatly deny after a year. (This is over something quite minor, but sexually-based, and considered serious by JW’s according to policy).
I am shaking and feeling cold as I am typing, but I thank you for expressing your thoughts on this religion. Many people are too polite and I get no feedback. This particular man went on to be mean to my children, my aging mother when she visited, and went out of his way to try to intimidate me. All within group situations, where he could act in such a way that others could not see what he was doing.
All for ??? what? To keep his “position?” It scares me. I’d like to think of it as a safe place, but thought it was just my PTSD causing problems with feeling comfortable there. The final word was that I should go to another congregation. And they used my PTSD against me, suggesting I had “distorted perceptions,” and that perhaps it was only a problem because of my PTSD. One of the congregation is a psychologist.
I’ve sent correspondence all the way to the governing body, and this was distributed to all the overseers down to the local elders. They were told they had to sort it out. Nothing has been done. (Partly because I’ve been too distraught to talk with any of them).
The man is in the position he desires. It made no difference whether I was not baptized, or baptized, the men stick together, and in my case, the woman is not believed. This causes me grave concerns about the safety of children, as they are more vulnerable than a grown woman. The bias is there even though they state they cannot take sides. Due to disclosing to the governing body, it has made it very difficult for them to disfellowship me (shunning), although I feel as though they are searching for excuses to do so.
As my mother joined this religion when I was four years old, if I “disassociate” myself from it, (like a voluntary form of shunning), then my mother will be put in a position of having to choose between the religion and contact with her daughter. For me, I feel very torn about the risk of losing contact with my mother totally. And I’ve started withdrawing emotionally.
I’ve been asked to “forgive” even though it is clear that the man is not repentant, since he cannot even admit to the relatively minor thing he’s done. I refused. Group psychology – he’s been there longer, also he’s “friendly.” It’s harder for a group to believe a newcomer. Unfortunately after reading about conflict resolution it seems that PTSD can make it difficult to effectively carry out conflict resolution techniques, so I am stuck as to how to move forward on this.
Sorry @Faith, I am taking up your blog with something that is perhaps unrelated. I’m feeling a bit shaky. I’ve registered for isurvive, but am just awaiting approval. Also found an interesting online group for DID. I noticed in their rules, that anyone hearing of illegal activity is legally required to report it to authorities. (Except victims? minor alters?)
And that those who have offended are asked not to share it unless they are ready to share it with authorities. I’m waiting to find out more about this. Bit shaky. Not sure how you deal with this on your blog? Or how isurvive deals with it. Is help only available for those who go through the mainstream justice system? I do not wish to go down that route.
Michael – my faith in a loving creator is not affected by a bunch of men in a building down the road. And I do believe that life is worth more than dirt. No matter how many people may treat a life as having little value.
“Often when speaking to Jehovah Witnesses it seems they somehow feel they can tell me how it is.” I’ve experienced the same myself. And find it very frustrating. I’ve kind of given up on the big doctrinal issues that I used to feel excited about working through to solve. I still believe in the truth in the Bible. (Though most Christian religions do not live up to the teachings of the Christ written in it). I am experiencing major conflict about this religion. Wish I could “tell how it is,” but I haven’t reached a happy ending to this story yet. I’m not angry or upset at all about what you’ve said. And I do not feel picked on. I don’t mean to bring up a boring or offensive subject for you! : ) Bit shaky though, so I’m calling it a day.
Good work you are getting it figured out. It can be that the JW were good for then and not for now. It seems you do find something you needed at the time.
it is totally related to the work Faith does and how men abuse in the context of a group relationship. Well it is one way. It is isolating. Kinda the opposite of the abuser who is nice while in the group.
Although you are worried about your children which is understand it is still about you.
The only church I know of that is about self is the Unitarians. I have never belonged I tend to get along with them. Kinda like I tend to get along with artists.
Hi, NoFear InLove.
No need to apologize. You are welcome to talk through issues like this on the blog. :0)
Speaking of apologies — Sorry it took me so long to approve all of your comments. All should be published now, and your future ones will post as soon as you submit them. In addition to working through the issues I have been blogging about, I had another bout of reflux, so I have been physically unwell. I haven’t checked in on the blog since earlier this week. :0(
Re: PTSD symptoms and church — I have learned to trust my intuition. If it tells me that something is wrong, I listen and don’t let other people talk me out of listening to it. Don’t let other people use your trauma history to control you or cause you to second-guess yourself. If your intuition is telling you to leave, I would leave.
Re: criminal activity — I have never had a reader share about ongoing criminal activity, so I have not had to deal with that situation. I cannot speak for isurvive — I would read through its policies. I have written about child on child abuse, and some members have worked through their feelings about having performed sexual acts on other children when they were children themselves. While I encourage them to forgive themselves and make amends, I don’t address the situation as a criminal matter.
~ Faith
Thanks Faith, and Michael,
I hope your reflux is settling down Faith. Don’t be sorry, you sound like a very busy mum. (mom)
It’s true about the religion being something that was needed at the time. And my intuition (gut feeling) is that I don’t like the thought of going in any more.
They are on the whole nicer than the horrible lot who got hold of me many years ago. I have learned that I dislike hypocrisy more than badness from people who have not learned any better. I hope that the people involved in these things have changed their ways. I expect many may be dead, or in jail, or very sick. (Due to occupational hazards).
I do feel safe from them now. This is due to my faith in God. (Jehovah is my refuge.)
***triggering on many levels***
In fact — this is a warning that this may be very scary to pretty well anyone.
****VERY SCARY****
*******trigger warning for rape, murder, cannibalism, body parts, ritual abuse, forced sex slavery, drugged abduction, forced medical procedures, torture*******
It seems my case is a little different in that there were adults in various groups. Not just child on child. The advice I’ve received is not to name names or locations of abusers, but it is okay to say what happened to me.
Some groups I’m guessing were in their 20’s to 30’s, others were maybe in their 40’s or older. There was a large group of kids in their late teens, including my brother and a friend of his.
There were cannibals who had their food on large white dinner plates. (Which somehow made it seem worse.) There were professional people, and bikers, I guess the teenage group may have been Satanists, as my brother had been living with Satanists, one of whom slept in a coffin. There were cauldrons, and a ritual murder organized by a guy in a disguise which made me think of a wizard or magician. I’m guessing it was the murdered man whom they ate. Also I think his eyes were also in the “fridge” with the body parts. They had a frozen look of horror on them. After he had been stabbed, I saw his face was ripped off while he was still alive.
There were medical procedures, ie, they inserted an IUD into me, which was too big, after one particularly violent rape which broke the “protection” they were using. Well, as well as breaking me up inside, literally. It is the most pain I have ever felt in my life. (I lived in pain for years afterward, without realizing the IUD was there. When it came out, in two stages, I didn’t understand what it was, and didn’t realize it had come out of *me*)
I was given chest compressions, and mouth-to-mouth resuscitation as I died from that particular rape. It was my boyfriend’s brother. He was enraged because I had recognized him, and pleaded for help with my eyes. He broke my hands, and damaged other parts of my body. The resuscitation was simply so they could carry on with many more rapes.
There were body parts taken from a dead girl. I saw her just before they let me go free. She looked in her late teens. I guessed she had been through the same as me and did not survive it. The “doctor” in the white coat was holding a scalpel. She was in a “bath” full of blood. Her hands were in a bucket. She had no eyes, just sockets which had tears of blood on the lower lids. It was pure horror.
I was taken from one place to another, to another. I’m pretty sure I don’t remember all the places yet. I remember being stretched on a rack. I remember being hogtied. I saw the guy in charge of me receive money for swinging me over to a heavily bearded older guy, (one of the cannibals), for him to have sex with me, while I held on to the “swing” to stop from falling over. My leg broke around the ankle when I think he must’ve been trying to get me to fall off, or lose consciousness. I have a good grip, so I’m guessing it was no accident that my foot hit the table and I fell upside down and hit my head on the table leg I am guessing. Spinning, and then hit my head again, I thought it would come off.
I had been lured into the city with a guy I’d just met, under false pretences. He had just come out of jail. I hadn’t thought this was dangerous, since my other brother (the one who is now dead), had been in jail before, and had come back home as he wished to leave the gang he was in. I am very non-prejudiced, and have always been taught to “love my brother.”
Once in the taxi, I asked this guy what he’d been in jail for, and he said “murder.” That’s when I started to feel scared. I considered jumping out of the taxi, but it was locked, and I felt I would get hurt at speed on the highway. So I was waiting for the taxi to stop at the lights so I could escape. It never stopped, until it reached the destination. I have a terrible sense of direction and was depending upon this guy to keep his word and deliver me back after this trip to the city. He didn’t keep his word. (surprise?) He brought me a glass of beer. It was drugged. I went to the toilet, some very hard women accosted me right in the cubicle, and I decided to risk walking straight out even though I was lost.
I saw a police station, it was deserted. I saw a guy I recognized as a new friend I’d met the previous year. He was in an alleyway and stood right next to the guy from the taxi who drugged me. I got past them, around the corner, and one popped out of an alleyway in front of me, and turned to walk ahead of me! Footsteps behind me, I turned to cross the road, and looked, it was the guy I had thought was a friend. I suddenly felt myself falling, and this guy made it look as though he were walking straight past me. I was conscious of thinking that he had time to save me from hitting my head on the curb, but he did not make any effort. I didn’t realize I’d been drugged. I thought I was very very sick.
They took me to a boat. Maybe some sort of cargo ship. I used to love the water, and wanted to learn how to sail a boat. When I finally booked in for lessons on a big sailing ship, I couldn’t bring myself to go, even though I forfeited the money I spent as a deposit. Didn’t know why at the time.
At the end, they showered me, dressed me, did my hair up, brushed my teeth, put on my boots, and walked me out past a bunch of grinning, wolfish-looking young men watching a close circuit tv of some sort which showed the bed I’d been lying on. The guy in charge of me flicked them a video cassette. He’d been sitting in front of a computer at a table near the foot of the bed. I remember the first time I worked in an office and they brought in their first new computer. It wasn’t long before I stopped working there due to stress, with an “unknown” cause.
Enough. It was a long time ago. It’s been reported to the police. It took two years for me after the memories started coming out to become coherent enough, and stop getting shaky and cold and terrified, to be able to talk about it. The reason I went in was mostly due to the two dead people I remember seeing. My brother (now dead) had been missing at various stages of my childhood, and it is an awful thing not knowing whether a loved one is alive or dead.
Maybe this answers the question of what people go on to do when they have been brought up in this sort of “cult” situation. Whether it was a cult I don’t know. The guy in charge of me claimed, and still claims to be a year younger than I. He would have been in his mid teens at the time this happened. His eyes looked much much older than his age in years. And hard, and strange. These days he doesn’t have such a hard look in his eyes. I’m hoping that’s because he has a new life where this sort of thing is not welcome. I’ve experienced kindness from him in recent years. (Before I realized what he had done in the past, and became so terrified when he seemed to be denying it. That suggested to me he was still doing these things. Logic tells me now that this is not necessarily true)
I am so sorry.
I want you to know that I believe you. Not diminishing your experience it is not outside my knowledge base in that nothing you describe surprises me. It is for lack of better words more modern than my experience and my abusers were for the most part rural. I still have some work to do about the cities.
One thing I do know about the cities is there is no fear of the brave men and women of law enforcement as they do not go to those parts of town. They are to scared. Well they and the judges may go there to practice their sickness.
I just had a key to the cities. I knew that a judge was trying to buy me from one of the behavioral scientists after the MKULTA school was shut down and they were killing the children that had no where to be placed. I had remembered the negotiations and the superintendent of schools refusing. I had other things on my mind as Mamma was being tortured to death over months and months at the time.
So I was sold and taken to the city. Good to know. That one has been hard to get at which makes sense as there was lots of killing of people that I had worked with as a prostitute. It is much harder for me to process the deaths when I knew them and or they happened over time.
Just giving some perspective here I was still getting good grades, playing baseball. becoming a good skier. excelling in 4-H and getting citizenship awards ect. I was doing a science project on internal combustion. Go figure. I lost out to a stupid volcano. Worse yet I lost out the next year and I had cross pollinated my own color of sweet pea.
You did a good thing to day. NoFear InLove. This will make my processing of the horror of the cites easier for me to get at. I can get at experiences where there is no context. It takes a lot of work.
No way of knowing what would have happened. I was at risk this morning of ending up on a fugue and not knowing where or who I was. This happens when I search for part of my life that is missing. It it not that I am drawn to the cult or that I “dissociate” I want to know about my life. All of it. Some call it a mental illness.
Michael — it is nice to know, firstly, that you’ve been able to read this, and secondly that you believe me. That is important to me. My spine is shaking. I’m sorry to hear that you have unprocessed stuff from the cities. This was definitely in the heart of the city, at the port. When I was set free, I walked down the wharf railway tracks until I got to a big spiky gate and took my shoes off, climbed up with my broken hands, and wrapped my toes around the metal posts, and jumped off from the top. It’s somewhere over 2 metres tall I estimate. I wondered if the guy in charge thought I was a prostitute. He was tricked by the guy who brought me there in the taxi. He seemed remorseful the last time I saw him. And when I did confront him for the first time, it was by phone, he had said “he didn’t know me back then.” Seems like someone who pre-judges other people and thinks it’s all right to treat certain people very badly, in a way they would never treat another kind of person. I hope he no longer does this.
Funny you should say about your brilliance in school and life, despite the abuse. I went back to school at 18, (I had left at 16), and was awarded joint Dux at the end of the year, alongside a girl of the “correct” year. (Highly irregular for them to do something like that). I’ve worked within a variety of different industries since then. Right up until I had my first baby. Then I’ve completely dedicated myself to raising them.
It is not OK to break anyone’s hands. No matter what you think they do to make money.
No, I agree. There’s no good reason to break *anyone’s* hands. This guy didn’t consciously intend to break my hands, he was just too busy being angry and raping me, that he crushed my hands. My thumbs were pretty useless for a long time. I couldn’t use a can opener, you know the kind that you turn the handle on? I went back to the old faithful one, the old fashioned kind that you stab the can with, and then lever up and down. I had to learn a new way to hold a pen to write with. Recently, since I remembered what happened, I’ve been trying to write in the normal way I used to before the attack. It doesn’t work very well. And I end up feeling very tired, and frustrated.
I still have handwriting I can not do as it is to intense. One reason I type.
I am really hoping if I just get more rested I will not have an issue. If not at least I will be more rested to do the work.. Oh bother.
Michael,
I’m hearing that you’re very tired. (in need of rest). Is everything really okay? I mean, … well, as an example, I used to get really tired, but then I just seemed like so tired, I felt like I was going to die. So I took myself for a very rare visit to the Doctor. Blood test showed a very very low iron count. (Which suggested a deficiency in many minerals, from my own research). Iron therapy helped. Also I started some alternative therapy which included a nutrition plan designed to reduce inflammation and pain. As well as boosting mineral/vitamin intake using naturally rich food sources. And strange as it sounds, I also received advice on how to sleep. It worked. I’m not doing it now, so I’m a bit tired again.
Yes I am very tired. This work is very hard.
” It worked. I’m not doing it now, so I’m a bit tired again.”
I always go with if the problem recurs the solution was not effective other than a temporary measure. My multiplicity was much more effective at temporary measures that what is commonly used temporary measures. Yoga-Positive affirmations-staying in the moment-meds-etc
Ah, it’s when I don’t stick to a regular time to go to bed, and a regular time to get up. I think getting a computer just for myself will help, as I am sharing one at present, and we’re all using it more than we used to. I was told to keep away from computer screens etc, for three hours before going to bed. It worked. Also wearing socks to bed worked to stop me waking up cold in the middle of the night. Just really simple stuff I thought when I was given it. And nothing to eat or drink for three hours before bed. I see what the problem is now. I’ve started using the internet, and the only practical time to use it is in the evening. I’ll get my own one cheap computer from somewhere and use it during the day, then I’ll go back to my regular sleep routine.
RE: Hypnotism and moral codes.
Yes, people can be tricked.
It’s much easier, however, to change a child’s ‘code’. So that murdering another child becomes ‘acceptable’, or attacking them with a knife. Where it’s just a part of ‘normal life’.
Get them while they are young. Muck up their mind. Make them think it’s all okay (the sexual abuse, everything).
Then you can muck them up good – and control them (somewhat) because of what you did and what you taught them.
It can be very hard to take control back from them. However, I was very good.
That is why it is POST tsd. It is not until something else is known that it has the effect. In the moment you do what you have to do. The reptilian brain knows it is wrong and overriding that is what causes the long term effect.
The concept of trauma is still seen as events. Even when a person has an issue with an event it is not known if it is a trauma on top of other trauma. The reptilian brain stores traumatic events singularly and that is why the memories come back the way they do. The effect of the trauma on the brain is over time not specific to events. Trauma on one level is cumulative.
Often an abuser is seen as a person who sometimes abuses a child rather than a person who is an abuser. This is more of the seeing trauma as an event or series of events.
Least that is the way I see it.
I describe this as having like a shoebox full of photos inside the brain, and the photos are all jumbled up. Unsorted. The difficult part is initially pulling out one photo at a time, and recognizing the picture on it. It evokes the terror, and emotions.
Then eventually being able to place each picture on the table (mentally, or by drawing stick figures, cartoon-like), so as to figure out the sequence of events. Some are easier to figure out than others. Some don’t have enough ‘clues’ to figure out. And I find there are still gaps between ‘photos,’ meaning that I probably have more memories in the ‘shoebox.’
Help with understanding has come from many different places throughout my life. Slowly a frame of reference has built up, through the brain associating certain present day situations with the buried past traumatic memory associations. I don’t know how the brain did this, it did it on it’s own, over about twenty years.
This subconscious (?) process did have a certain sensation with it. Almost like a pleasant addiction to certain situations, that didn’t seem entirely rational at the time. Later it became clear how that particular learning had helped to build up the frame of reference to a point where basic understanding could happen.
When this traumatic event happened out of the blue, I had no frame of reference to help understand the event. No language to explain it.
The photo reference is valid. It is how the reptilian brain stores things some times. Think ducking. It is a learned response. When you turn on a light switch you do not think. it is not well I need to get power to create heat which will emit light so I need to made a connection to a power source ect. Although that is the method often used to try and heal from trauma.
I get what you are saying on the 1st & 3rd paragraphs. I kinda get what I think you are saying in the 2nd. The amagdala, hippocampus, hypothalamus, and thalamus, (discounting the sensory cortex; it is always involved in experiences) are affected by anything that frightens us. Such neural networks are being built as a child. Therefore fear has a very significant effect on the brain of a developing child. Thus cumulative fear responses would lead to more developed pathways in those regions of the brain – causing a physical effect in the neural wiring of a person. That may or may not be able to be changed. What is known is that a person’s response to those ‘fear’ responses can be changed – somewhat. Our heart is always going to be racing to the beat of rotor blades. Certain types of things are ‘always’ going to ‘set us off’ in some way. We can’t help it. But we can help by trying to recognize those things. We being me & “I”.
Unfortunately there is no easy explanation for the consequences of childhood ritualistic abuse – or in our case, a military one (of authority and command, if nothing else – in ‘my’ case and not yours, of course). The effect run deep; clear through the brain. Is ‘rewiring the brain’ even possible? It appears so, as studies have been proving. The old concept of “positive self-reinforcement” still sounds good – and still works in some things. Cognitive therapy (my friend) – has done some wonderful things for me; albeit I’ve had to do it on my own. (Perhaps I am the Poster Child for Self-Therapy, LOL. Or simply another lost man.)
At any rate each of us is a complicated issue, you and I and ‘friends’ (and debaters) here on the internet. A real ball of wax (with worms!) to psychiatrists sometimes. Oh well – that’s their problem and not ours. (softly smiling). We understand ourselves quite well. Sort of. (lol’ing going on from several of my alters in my mind, LOL’ing right on with them, too.)
One of the first changes I noticed to my body when I knew I was abused was I got cold. I really did not get cold before. I did not dissociate those pathways were just not open. I went one winter in leather moccasins with no sock and was hitchhiking. My feet were never cold.
I know others with PTSD and it is the opposite. They get very cold and yet can take the heat. The heat used to drain me. It has all leveled out now although I seem to be able to take the heat and cold better than most people. Might just be I figured out long ago I don’t control the weather.
To heal the parts of the brain you mention which I just call the reptilian brains I do a lot of work with meditation in motion and a lot with water. I learn new things about how the water can change my brain daily.
I thought the coldness was from going into shock from my body having a late reaction to the abuse. Or from the mind finally responding to the signals that never made it at the time of the abuse, due to the brain protecting itself and the body from dying. Shaky and cold. Bit scary when it first started happening. Later I’d wrap up warm in blankets and lie still until warmth started to come back. Some rest was required.
And yes I found it difficult to cope with the heat, too. Absolute exhaustion. Brain exhaustion, causing total body collapse. Not so bad this summer just gone. And coping better with the winter cold this year. Not sure if the weather has warmed up a bit. Or if the insulation and new carpet makes a big difference! Or, I’m just not doing very much physical, and keeping away from enclosed buildings with crowds of people. It’s nice not getting sick this year. I hadn’t thought of it being related to PTSD.
There’s a book on Adrenal Fatigue which had an interesting diagram of how all the endocrine system works together. Hypervigilance etc, fight and flight responses, can wear out the adrenal glands. This affects the functioning of all the other glands. (Sympathetic or parasympathetic? Autonomous nervous system?) From memory this may have had something to do with body temperature. Peaceful rest and nourishment was important. Removing all forms of stress, situations, places, people, certain foods, chemicals…
What is know about the adrenal system and what to do follows the medical model. That the sun is needed and that the adrenal system has to first heal. It is much like having a knee injury and starting physical therapy before the knee has had time to heal.
The thing is the only way to heal the adrenal system is through processing the trauma which in effect activates the adrenal system. Deep processing not the cognitive understanding of what happened. That is only the start. The cognitive understanding takes a lot out of a person which is one of the many reasons healing is hard and or not done.
I have not heard it much lately. Back in the day it was all about not re traumatizing Or as I call it the therapist can’t handle it. If you have traumatic memories come into your conscious and are not traumatized you are a psychopath. One step up is a therapist who can listen but does not really understand and you can tell as they go with well you don’t have to process every little thing. That is a window of opportunity to delude yourself you can avoid the hard work. Thing is you will know when you have processed the trauma to where it needs to be processed. You can tell as you are not longer PTSD.
About the adrenal system. The book was Adrenal Fatigue by James L. Wilson. The medical profession only deals with extremes such as Addison’s disease, and I can’t remember the disease at the other end of the scale. This book covers the in-between range outside of optimum health which is in the middle of the scale. The part the medical profession doesn’t know how to fix. (There’s my book review – hee hee)
From my experience in working with survivors, breaking the trauma bond is a key to the quantum leap in healing. There is such a strong pull to take care of the woman you call Momster and who calls herself an old woman. Did it occur to you that she is still trying to tie in to the old tapes? Is there a possibility that you remember yourself saying something like this? “You can do anything you want to to me, but don’t hurt my mother?”
Hi, Allison.
My abusers used my sister as the threat, not my mother, so my memories are of the same script but replacing “mother” with “sister.”
Yes, you are absolutely correct. I had a friend read the letter (I wrote about that for Tuesday), and she picked up on a recurring theme throughout the letter of mothers and children returning to each other intermixed with a lot of sick triggers. More on that topic on Tuesday…
~ Faith
Hey Allison,
About the tapes thing. Some extreme trauma survivors have experienced patterning based on Dr. Cameron’s theories and actual tape recordings were used. Some of the cults learned this method.
i often wonder if the tapes thing did not come from when Cameron was the head of the mental health field. Not with purpose just a borrowed thing.
[…] have been working on healing the traumatized part of myself that was triggered by momster’s letter. That part was too terrified at first to reveal anything specific that I could use to heal it, so I […]
[…] in my presence. It makes sense that the threat that I am processing today (that I reacted to in momster’s letter) would have happened soon after my mother made me aware that she had started sexually abusing my […]